How Vegan Are You?
This is another post in the Becoming Vegan series aimed to help those who are considering going vegan or who are new to the diet.
Every vegan has a different goal or purpose for their diet and lifestyle. They don’t all put the same weight or importance on their diet or the products that they use, so it is sometimes challenging for two vegans to agree with what is really vegan. When asked what diet they follow, they will both answer vegan while inwardly thinking that the other person is not being honest with themselves or others.
| Did you know? Standard white sugars are often whitened with bone char. Not all brands do this, so if you do not know which brand does not use bone char I would advise buying sugar that explicitly carries the word “vegan” on its label. |
For example, one vegan may continue to use honey, while the other vegan may only use agave nectar. Or one vegan may use standard white sugar without knowing, as the other vegan does, that it’s as white as it is because of bone char. Then, taking it one step further, one may wear leather shoes, and the other may only choose to wear pleather or hemp.
I admit that I haven’t gone beyond food much yet, and even now I am still discovering things that I thought were vegan aren’t even vegetarian (white sugar is something I found out about only last year). One reason for this is that many natural and vegan products, including cosmetic and cleaning supplies, are extraordinarily expensive. I do purchase products like these from time to time, however until the monetary prices come down, it will be hard for me to be willing to fork over the money for them on a consistent basis.
As I am writing this I am coming to the conclusion that this is a challenging subject because there are so many differing opinions. It’s easy for me to talk to other vegans (or even vegetarians or omnivores) and feel like I am not vegan enough, or even vice versa, but as soon as I start feeling that way that is the point where I realize that my veganism is turning into a religion. As soon as guilt and blame enter the picture, I have to be careful.
Because of this, I think it is important to remember to respect your fellow vegans. It’s not always easy being vegan, so if you feel they are eating something they shouldn’t, try to be diplomatic in your approach if you really feel obligated to share it with them. As I said before, I believe your diet, no matter what it is, should never become a religion. I live in NYC and believe me, you become immune to the subway preachers and Times Square evangelists. Everyone’s trying to convert someone and after awhile it falls on deaf ears. Change your tune if you think you may be coming across as a pesky vegan evangelist – turn it into a two-way conversation, not a one-way sermon. This applies to conversations with non-vegans, too.
Action Step
Ask yourself if you plan on only being a dietary vegan or if you are going to let this spread to your clothes and hygiene products, too. If you do plan on expanding past the dietary, do some research into what products you would buy instead of the old standard brands you’ve relied on for years, and price it out. Decide if you can afford it or if you want to just replace one product at a time.
Question
If you’re already a long-time vegan, how far does your vegan lifestyle go? Does it stop at food and not extend into your shampoo, makeup and shoes? Or are you striving to be 100% in every aspect of your life? Additionally, do you encounter this type of situation where another vegan doesn’t think you’re really vegan or vice versa?
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{ 65 comments }
Samantha,
I applaud your hard work and ethusiasm. I came across your website because I need support in my transition from vegetarian to vegan. Newbie vegans or people who are interested need useful information not someone behind a computer preaching at them, If i want to be discouraged I would just turn to friends/family. I am taking baby steps and doing the best that I possibly can. Thanks for all your help!!
If you are working toward becoming Vegan then you should get advice from someone/a place that is actually Vegan.
I’m, um, kind of stunned by everything I see here. I’m not going to say much, as I don’t see a point to it at this juncture, but what I do want to say is that there’s bigger tofu to fry. We’re all, regardless to what degree, taking steps to better the earth, treat animals humanely, etc. Every little bit helps, with or without labels that may or may not be earned depending on who believes or doesn’t believe something to be true.
“This is another post in the Becoming Vegan series aimed to help those who are considering going vegan or who are new to the diet.”
THIS is what turns people away from the true idea of veganism. You are encouraging the mindset that there is a moral distinction between animals used for food or any other purpose.
And Veganism is not a diet
“The word vegan was coined in 1944 by Donald Watson, who combined the first three and last two letters of vegetarian to form “vegan,” which he saw as “the beginning and end of vegetarian.”[9][15] Vegan is pronounced /ˈviːɡən/[16] or /ˈvɛdʒən/,[17] although Watson considered the latter pronunciation to be incorrect.[18] The Vegan Society defines veganism in this way:
[T]he word “veganism” denotes a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practical — all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of humans, animals and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals.”
Adam, there is no “true” vegan. And even if there is one you’d need to turn off your computer and go live in a cave to be one so your argument comes from a position of hypocrisy.
I don’t think the author is encouraging a mindset of distinction that is irresponsible. We all make distinctions as to what is possible and practical for ourselves and our society, and those positions change over time (hopefully towards sustainability and compassion for life). The argument of being vegan is not one of absolutes, because if it were as I said – you’d not be consuming electricity or food grown by agriculture at all – you would be a gatherer only.
This discussion is one about positions along a continuum. You yourself likely justify your use of electricity (which is produced by the direct, inhumane death of animals) for some myriad of reasons (this is only one in thousands of systems you must interact with and perpetuate to exist in modern society that comes at the cost of animal life).
The only difference between you and the author is that you seem to think you don’t exist in the same real world that everyone else does, and therefore feel somehow justified in your arrogance and ignorance.
While I remain committed to being vegan as much as is possible and practical for me and my family, I reject both your thesis, and your method because the ideal you claim to argue from is clearly not one that you, nor any modern person can attain.
Could you explain how using electricity and/or consuming food produced via agriculture is morally similar to using such unnecessary products as nonvegan clothing, cosmetics, etc.?
Additionally, please explain “And even if there is one you’d need to turn off your computer and go live in a cave to be one so your argument comes from a position of hypocrisy.” The grammatical misstep aside, I assume you’re trying to say that the “true” vegan needs to turn off her computer and live in a cave to avoid being hypocritical.
What definition of vegan are you using? It’s clear you’re reading something into Adam’s “thesis” and “method” that isn’t there.
I don’t know of a single form of electricity that doesn’t either displace (in the case of large-scale solar), or directly harm (hydro, wind) animals. Not to mention conventional power production which powers most of the computers in between yours and mine. Any industrial operation is bound to result in the unnatural death and displacement of animals for human benefit. The same is true with all modern agriculture. Even mid-sized organic farm operations exist on land that was cleared, and is maintained in a perpetual non-natural state resulting in the displacement and harm of animal life.
My point is simply that even fundamentalist vegans participate in, and perpetuate systems that are unethical and unsustainable. And even fundamentalist vegans vary in their interpretation and execution on what it means to be vegan. Taken to logical extremes though, fundamentalist vegan logic breaks down and does not work in the real world as evidenced by us all sitting in front of a computer screen at this moment.
Given this reality one would think the fundamentalist vegan could have a bit more respect and tolerance for those who are not quite as far along on the path. But like all fundamentalist religions, it’s more important to be right than compassionate.
My personal position is that the words “as far as is possible and practical” in the vegan definition by Donald Watson is important. I (like you) take that as more serious than “when convenient”, but I do not take it to read “without exception” as some vegans do. Additionally, I interpret this definition from the perspective of each individual, not as a universal definition for society, and this is how I apply vegan principals in my own life (when possible and practical). I believe Watson specifically left these words in to discourage the kind of “holier than thou” attitude we see among many vegans today.
While I’m always open to a respectful discussion, I do not believe that Watson’s intention was for the definition to be used to isolate and judge others. I see veganism is an inclusive philosophy, not exclusive.
When someone like Adam says (among other things), “If you are a vegan for health reasons you are not a vegan.” I reject both his thesis, and his method of delivery. I gave up on religion of this nature a long time ago.
Ryan,
Again. You’re treating all harms alike, and it’s unclear why this is appropriate. No reasonable person accepts that hitting and killing someone with your car unintentionally, while driving safely, is the same as murdering them so you can use them for fashion. In like manner, my justifiable use of electricity may incidentally harm some animals but that situation is in no way comparable to my unjustifiable use of them for cosmetic purposes.
I’m not sure where Adam’s health reason comment comes in here. I took it that you were disagreeing with his claim: “You are encouraging the mindset that there is a moral distinction between animals used for food or any other purpose.” It sounds like you agree that the author is wrong to use animals for cosmetic purposes. If you don’t find that behavior morally objectionable, then please explain why.
As for Adam’s “method,” it’s unclear what you disagree with. Are you opposed to critical discussion? I mean, you seem terribly interested in shutting it down.
If you willingly and knowingly consume non-vegan products, food or not, that means you are not a vegan. Period. End of story.
So Corey, do you also consider people who use products in which animals die as a byproduct non-vegans? For example, all the animals that die in the production of electricity to power the computers that we all use, or the animals that die in the manufacture of the keyboard we type on? How about the animals that die as a byproduct of (even organic and local) food production, such as animals that are displaced, or directly killed as a result of farming?
There’s a lot of hypocrisy in radical veganism because when one takes a little time and thinks about all the systems and products we interact with one realizes that by strict definition there is no vegan – period. End of story.
I don’t mean to take your argument to the extreme as an excuse to shun responsibility when it comes to caring for life and the environment. I simply want to suggest that “being vegan” isn’t an end, but a process. If it is to be an end in and of itself, then none of us are vegans, because in developed countries it is next to impossible to be so. But when being vegan is philosophically taken as a process or journey towards sustainability, authentic human existence, and responsibility – then there’s more room for all of us to accept, respect, and help each other.
Some things are easily avoidable and/or have a simple alternative while other things have no real alternative and can’t be avoided as easily.
The society we live in currently doesn’t always give an alternative to something or make things avoidable.
Not consuming animal products directly, or wearing them, or using them for entertainment aren’t difficult as there are alternatives.
Ryan, you’re acting as if every act that harms an individual is morally identical, and hence, morally wrong. Take driving a car, for instance. Although there’s a chance that my driving a car will injure or kill a person, my commitment to human rights does not oblige me not to drive whereas it does commit me to not torturing and murdering people. There’s an important distinction to be made here. My driving (practiced safely of course) can be justified by good reason whereas my murdering cannot.
There is good reason for most of us to use electricity, consume agriculturally grown foods, etc. There is no such good reason for most of us to consume nonvegan foods, to buy nonvegan cosmetics, etc. That’s the difference. If you’d like to discuss what some of the reasons are, I’d be happy to talk about specific examples.
“But when being vegan is philosophically taken as a process or journey towards sustainability, authentic human existence, and responsibility – then there’s more room for all of us to accept, respect, and help each other.”
What in the world are you talking about?
Jason, I’m not arguing that – Adam is. I’m simply taking his argument to its (un)logical conclusion. I am in agreement with you – these things are not morally the same.
However, neither is it morally the same to consume animal products indiscriminately versus eating a 99.9% non-animal diet but eat a single slice of grandma’s non-vegan pumpkin pie at Thanksgiving with the family.
Adam (and some others) argue that these things share moral equivalence and therefore a person is not allowed to call themselves vegan because they have that slice of pie.
Like you, I find that argument ridiculous. I have no problem with that person calling themselves a vegan.
As to the other comment I’m just saying that I don’t see veganism as an end unto itself, but as a process. If you treat it as a process, then I think it’s possible to be more respectful and tolerant of other people’s journey towards sustainability.
I am comfortable with anyone calling themselves ‘vegan’ who commits themselves to the the journey.
I agree with you that being vegan involves learning and incremental changes of behavior.
But, I don’t follow that we should call “vegan” someone who knowingly consumes animal products for no good reason. It’s unclear what the person who does that has committed herself to.
It would be just as unreasonable to call someone a human rights advocate who engaged in the occasional, knowing bit of cannibalism. I don’t think many of us would be prepared to call that person a human rights advocate. Would you?
Here comes the “minimization of suffering” attempt…wait for it….
“It drives me nuts when even vegetarians say that they eat fish. Then you’re not a vegetarian! It’s not like they grow fish on trees. :)”
It drives me nuts when authors say vegans can eat honey if they want or defend the “occasional” consumption of animal products.
Violence is obviously not something you take seriously.
Thanks for your comments Adam. It’s clear that you are a vegan for ethical reasons.
Regarding the honey thing, when I started eating a vegan diet about four years ago I was confused in the beginning on whether or not that was vegan, mainly because there is a lot of debate over whether or not you’re still vegan if you consume it. As far as I know, there isn’t an “official” vegan spokesperson or leader who says it’s vegan or it isn’t. I eventually drew the line and came to my own conclusion that honey doesn’t fall under the vegan category. There are many who do not agree with that, however.
Your last statement is a weighted one, and it would be great to know what you mean more specifically about that. I’d also be very curious to know where you stand on local farms who aim to raise animals sustainably (i.e. Polyface Farms in Virginia).
Donald Watson and the Vegan Society UK came up with the term and definition of Vegan.
When it comes to food they say
“Vegans enjoy all kinds of plant foods – like fruits, vegetables, grains, nuts, seeds, legumes (beans, lentils and split peas) – and fungi (mushrooms, yeasts), and food made from these. Vegans choose not to eat any foods derived from living or dead animals – no meat of any kind (no red meat, poultry, white meat, fish etc.), no animal milks (no cow’s dairy products, nor sheep, goats etc.), no eggs, no honey, nor any other animal products (no gelatin, cochineal, shellac etc.)”
Ha, nice. Rahzh is right. Veganism as clearly defined in black and white is a lifestyle devoid of honey consumption. Will you now admit you are in error?
I’m glad you asked what I think about farms who exploit animals but are closer to our homes and more eco-friendly.
http://www.examiner.com/x-4198-Vegan-Examiner~y2009m7d12-Why-animal-rights-activists-arent-supporting-animal-welfarism
“So what if somebody is totally vegan except they have cheese every couple of months. Or if they like to have a piece of tilapia once in a blue moon. Does it really matter?”
Yes. It does matter in the same way as it matters if someone refers to themselves as non-violent but performs a violent act “once in a blue moon”
If someone who will call themselves vegan will justify the consumption of a product of violence, there is a serious problem there. I doubt very much there is much of a concern about the individuals who actually suffer for your tilapia. Rather, it seems to me you’re looking for enabling from us, to tell you you can feel okay for acting hypocritically.
Again, it would be great for you to describe what you mean about “violence” as well as where you think the line is drawn. I can come to my own assumptions, however even people who follow this line of thought approach it in very different ways. For example, some (not all) would argue, and perhaps you also do, that it is violent and unnatural to keep domesticated animals (i.e. cats, dogs or birds).
The larger issue to me is exploitation as you describe. I don’t see why we need to draw a line somewhere though. Why can’t we just be non-violent period?
I believe that bringing animals into this world in order to be our property, whether as cows, pigs, dogs, or cats, is exploitation. Their value is defined by how they fulfill our interests. Any of their considerations of welfare can be traded away if our interests to use them conflict.
Which does not mean we aren’t willing to rescue and take care of animals (cows,chickens,dogs,cats,etc).
The animals alive now do need taken care of,but they should not just exist for human use/ownership and we shouldn’t continue to breed them.
This is interesting Adam. So you would say that anyone who has a ‘pet’ or domesticated animal is also by definition not a vegan?
I do not want to speak for Adam,but I will until he does. I would say his response is no to your question. Reason being has to do with my reply to his (the one about rescuing and caring for animals).
“Which does not mean we aren’t willing to rescue and take care of animals (cows,chickens,dogs,cats,etc).
The animals alive now do need taken care of,but they should not just exist for human use/ownership and we shouldn’t continue to breed them.”
“Acting adversely towards others who don’t entirely share your belief system seems to be hypocritical to me.”
You don’t believe someone can be compassionate while disagreeing?
And how is it compassionate to call those who defend the logic of a non-violent lifestyle as “evangelical”?
May I suggest to you…very compassionately…that you actually listen to what we are saying instead of defending your ego?
You can make your own natural cleaners for very very cheap. Things such as baking soda, lemon, and vinegar in various mixtures work wonders.
Rahzh, I have heard of this and I definitely want to explore this more. I think that’s totally doable, unfortunately some other products that many of us still want to use (makeup and other hygiene or personal products) are still very expensive. That’s probably where it gets expensive for me, but I am starting to consider exploring replacement brands that are sustainable, healthy and free from animal-testing.
Also, I highly recommend Dr. Bronner’s castile soaps. I use this for body wash, and I water it down quite a bit and it goes a long way. That is one thing that I consistently buy on a regular basis.
Hygiene items aren’t that much more expensive. Also you can make your own varieties of those if cost is actually a factor (and not just an excuse). Such as baking soda for toothpaste. And as you pointed out Dr. Bronner’s brand. They have some all purpose cleaners that can be used for everything (including yourself). Also some mainstream brands do not test on animals and some of their brands may also not contain animals.
At one point my wife and I (and our four fur kids) were living on a salary of 22k. We were able to buy plenty of food (more than we probably needed). Which included some processed things and snacks. We bought our hygiene items and cleaners. And we made sure our fur kids were taken care of. We didn’t go out a ton,but a few times we did.
Had we not eaten some processed foods, made some of our own cleaners, made some of our own hygiene items,went out less, and cooked more from scratch we could have even lived on less.
And on top of that we were paying a decent chunk of money per month towards old debts we have (before we smartened up). And we had rent, utilities, gas for the car, internet, a phone,etc.
“unfortunately some other products that many of us still want to use (makeup and other hygiene or personal products) are still very expensive.”
For starters, less is more (i.e. just use less makeup up / wear it less often). Also, you can sacrifice in some areas to spend a bit more in other areas. Plus, some of the more readily available vegan makeup isn’t really much more expensive than some of the quality cosmetics out there.
If a person really takes the interests of animals seriously, I should hope that their wanting to wear makeup wouldn’t end up being more important to them than the lives of the animals who are exploited to make that makeup. To think that one human’s vanity trumps a sentient creature’s life is disturbing; to think that someone would see it fit to call herself vegan while holding that mindset is just bizarre.
Who are you? Some vegans will eat honey? That’s like saying some celibates will have sexual intercourse. By definition, veganism is not a diet but a way of living.
This article is yet another exmaple of someone who knows very little about vegan living other than a bastardized redefining of something which is truly a conclusion of non-violence. You are not qualified to write this article.
“This article is yet another exmaple of someone who knows very little about vegan living other than a bastardized redefining of something which is truly a conclusion of non-violence. You are not qualified to write this article.”
Adam, while I appreciate your enthusiasm, this type of comment is exactly what turns off many would-be vegans from this lifestyle. I have followed a vegan diet for four years, and owe a lot of my health to it. I am still learning, as I am sure you are (even if you may not be a life-long vegan yourself), about the ins and outs of veganism. It always surprises me when I realize when I was in the dark about a particular product or practice.
You are also correct – I am not a qualified medical professional, so from that aspect I encourage anyone who is considering a vegan diet to make sure they include their doctor or dietician in the process. However, there are MANY vegans (yes, vegans) who do not practice it in all aspects of their lives. Everyone approaches their diet for different reasons, which is why I am asking in my post for us to respect each other, even if we do not agree entirely with each other. It’s important for new vegans to consider how they plan on approaching their personal veganism – do they plan on expanding past the diet, because if so, they MAY incur a lot of monetary costs which can be hugely expensive for a lot of people.
If it is just diet/health related they are not Vegan. They are strict vegetarian.
Veganism is not a diet. Please stop calling it “the vegan diet”
And so sorry I don’t make statements to make me popular, I’m far more concerned with the logical consistency of statements that one can consider themselves a vegan while continuing to consume easily avoidable products of animal exploitation.
“The word vegan was coined in 1944 by Donald Watson, who combined the first three and last two letters of vegetarian to form “vegan,” which he saw as “the beginning and end of vegetarian.”[9][15] Vegan is pronounced /ˈviːɡən/[16] or /ˈvɛdʒən/,[17] although Watson considered the latter pronunciation to be incorrect.[18] The Vegan Society defines veganism in this way:
[T]he word “veganism” denotes a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practical — all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of humans, animals and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals.”
As far as is practical and possible I am a vegan. I am also working on becoming more-so each year. This definition is a lot more inclusive than the radical extremists would make it out to be.
Thank you Rahza.
It is pretty inclusive. It means no purposeful consumption animals whether it be for clothes, entertainment,food,etc.
Rahza,
I don’t see anywhere it says “no purposeful consumption of animals”. As you mentioned in another quote above, we all “purposefully” consume animal products for which there is no alternative (such as electricity, or where animals are displaced because of food production).
By your additional qualification I admittedly do purposefully consume products that harm animals and thus cannot call myself vegan. If I did not, we could not have this conversation. I am aware there are animals that suffer as a result of the 100% green power I purchase from my electric company, and there are animals that are displaced and/or die as a result of some of the non-animal food I eat (although much of it is local and organic).
But by the definition you quoted, I could still call myself vegan as long as I am doing so as much as is practical and possible.
“However, there are MANY vegans (yes, vegans) who do not practice it in all aspects of their lives.”
Then they are not vegans. There is no such thing as a part-time vegan, or a 75% vegan. You’re grossly misrepresenting veganism. You’re telling people that they can call themselves vegan and continue to consume animals and animal products. That’s not veganism.
Samantha,
You say it drives you nuts when vegetarians say they eat fish.
It drives me nuts when self-proclaimed ‘vegans’ say they are ‘vegan’ for health or sustainability reasons, or only ‘vegan’ with respect to some animal products or use but not other animal products or use.
A person is a vegan just in case that person avoids animal products for moral reasons as far as is reasonably possible. (And under that definition, I find being a vegan very easy.)
While we can have reasonable disagreements about what counts as ‘reasonably possible’, saying you’re ‘vegan’ with regard to food-only, or that you consume some animal products but not others, or that you’re vegan for ‘health reasons only’ means you’re simply not a vegan.
I’d really appreciate it if people who don’t adhere to the definition above call themselves “strict vegetarians” or some other word than vegan. It’s not about religion; it’s not about nit-picking. It’s about the *real meaning* of a word that was coined by Donald Watson 65 years ago, but is now being cheapened, conflated, and co-opted by non-vegans to mean just about everything, and therefore nothing.
One thing that I didn’t mention in my comment about the fish, is that I am a lifelong vegetarian who was raised to believe that being vegetarian meant no meat of any kind whatsoever. So my irritation on that has lasted a long time. But it’s just an irritation, and to be honest, at the end of the day I don’t care if they call themselves vegetarian or not. It just doesn’t matter to me in the bigger scheme of things.
When you say “strict vegetarian” I automatically think to myself that that means someone who doesn’t eat meat or fish but who will still eat dairy or eggs. So for me, a person who does not eat any animal products of any kind, except for about 1% of the time (which means that it’s pretty rare for me to each outside of a vegan diet), it’s hard to identify with that label.
And maybe this is the problem – labels. This seems to be what is stirring up the pot here. I call myself a vegan, you call yourself a vegan, but you (and I am not just referencing you here – several have said this) clearly think that it’s just not possible for me to be a vegan. But here’s the difference: I still consider you to be a vegan even though I don’t follow your brand of veganism (whether or not your version of it is the original one). The truth is that many diets and institutions started out with a very specific intention, but have changed and morphed over time (not necessarily always for the bad). Perhaps my version of veganism really is veganism, but it doesn’t discount yours either.
Your version is not Veganism.
Vegetarian originally meant no animal products then people started calling themselves ovo or lacto vegetarian until vegetarian became the general term. Ovo/lacto vegetarian includes eggs and dairy an din some people’s minds the term vegetarian includes those things. So when you say strict vegetarian it means no eggs or dairy. So at best you are strict vegetarian (not Vegan).
Samantha,
I understand a “strict vegetarian” to be contrasted with a “lacto-ovo [or some other qualification] vegetarian”. Strict vegetarians don’t consume eggs or dairy, but may consume trace amounts of animal products and may be so for non-moral reasons.
Veganism implies the moral reasons and the consistency of avoiding animal products as much as is reasonably possible.
Accordingly, based on what you’ve said, you’re a strict vegetarian (which implies that you don’t consume eggs or dairy).
If a person is “Vegan” for health reasons/it is a diet then that person is a strict vegetarian. It is what Vegans do beyond diet/health reasons that makes them Vegan. It is how they live their life.
Vegans avoid things that have nothing to do with health/diet such as clothing, animal entertainment (such as rodeos), avoiding products that are tested on animals as best as possible,not hunting or fishing,etc.
Also if you occasionally eat non Vegan items (purposefully) whether it be when you travel, visit friends, go out with friends, finish someone’s food,etc then you are not vegan just like someone who eats fish is not vegetarian or Vegan.
Samantha wrote: “It drives me nuts when even vegetarians say that they eat fish. Then you’re not a vegetarian! It’s not like they grow fish on trees. :)”
I’m a little confused. I’m guessing that you’re saying that you’re vegan, right? Because your post seems to indicate that you are, yet you state that you consume (i.e. eat and / or use) animal products, and from your response to one of the comments, I’m guessing that you wouldn’t be calling yourself vegan if you consume animal products any more than you think it’s suitable for a vegetarian to call himself a vegetarian if he eats fish. Thanks in advance.
She’s not a vegan, she just likes the label.
Veganism is not expensive.
http://hungryhungryveganos.wordpress.com/2009/07/06/vegan-on-the-cheap/
I think veganism in general, at least at some level, is based on compassion and caring (as well of health, environment, etc.). Acting adversely towards others who don’t entirely share your belief system seems to be hypocritical to me. So what if somebody is totally vegan except they have cheese every couple of months. Or if they like to have a piece of tilapia once in a blue moon. Does it really matter? Not really. Are they still taking steps towards a better environment most of the time? Yes they are. I think that if something such as your diet becomes an obsession, and almost a religion, then something is not right with it. If the way I eat hindered my quality of life, which includes my physical and mental well being as well as my relationships with others, I would probably consider altering it.
As far as expense goes that’s a huge deal for me. I’m currently a full time student and am not working so money is tight. I use certain products that have a high probability of not being vegan because I can’t afford the vegan varieties. Good fruits and veggies by themselves are costly. Add to the mix vegan shoes, cleaning supplies, etc. and I’m broke. There’s a cultural problem in America as we only make unhealthy food affordable and jack the prices up on anything nutritious. If you don’t agree with that just look at a McDonald’s menu. Furthermore, I can’t just toss out all my old non-vegan items because one day I changed my view on animals – that would be wasteful and even more expensive.
My vegan lifestyle is like this: I do what I can and accept what I cannot. I became vegan because of compassion for animals and for my health. Do I try to follow a vegan lifestyle? Yes, as much as I can. Do I like still sushi? Yes. Do I eat sometimes? I do. But that doesn’t negate every other part of my vegan diet and lifestyle. If 1 meal out of 100 isn’t vegan then I’m still eating vegan 99% of the time. And I do feel like others will judge me for this. I don’t currently know any other vegans in my city. I haven’t tried to join any groups for I’m, to sound silly, afraid of rejection.
So, I feel we should accept people for who they are and not judge them by the choices they make that we do or do not agree with. It’s up to each person to decide what’s right for their life.
Thanks for your thoughtful response Amber. I identify with much of what you say. I have had so much guilt laid on me by others and myself that I have finally come to the conclusion that I’d rather not get stuck on that one non-vegan meal or bite of dessert. Overall I’d rather follow a vegan diet, but I can’t allow guilt to take over.
As far as the vegan non-food products go, I do buy several, but this is based mostly on sustainability reasons, not explicitly on animal-rights reasons. Still, I haven’t been able to bring myself to switch to all things sustainable because of the monetary costs – and I have a full time job! As you say, it’s good to do what you can and accept what you cannot.
I am a newbie vegan who has found your Becoming Vegan series very helpful! I have been a vegetarian for two years, so the transition isn’t too difficult. Besides, I’m doing it for AR and environmental reasons, which are pretty powerful motivators. While I’m still transitioning and I’m not yet 100% cruelty-free, I am aiming to eventually be vegan in every aspect of my lifestyle. Considering my reasons, I feel anything less would be hypocritical.
Thank you! I am glad that you are finding it helpful. Good luck in your transition, and I am glad you’ve joined the conversation!
It’s so hard when people start nitpicking. Like the other vegan in my program–she berated me for not using animal friendly enough shampoo and things like that. I’m vegan for sustainability purposes only–in fact, when I have the ability to raise my own chickens, I’m going to start eating eggs again. But for the moment I’m pretty much food-oriented. As for clothes, I basically only shop at thrift stores, so I figure leather isn’t too much of an issue in that case. Now the vegans who come up to me and say “I’m a vegan but I eat fish sometimes”–that drives me up a wall :)
It drives me nuts when even vegetarians say that they eat fish. Then you’re not a vegetarian! It’s not like they grow fish on trees. :)
I am vegan for ethical, environmental, and health reasons, but I do wholeheartedly agree with VeggieGirl. I am far from vegangelical, and those that are really bug me. It is one thing to share your knowledge of veganism when someone is interested, it is quite another to make them feel guilty for the choices they make. Being vegan means being compassionate to ALL living things, including humans -even if they don’t share the same ethics as you.
I must note though that if you are “vegan for health reasons”, you are NOT a vegan – you eat a vegan diet. True vegans abstain from the use of animal products for any purpose (its in the definition ). I personally don’t buy or consume any animal products for food, I don’t wear any animal products for clothes, and I don’t buy any beauty or household products that are tested on animals or include animal derived ingredients. I must admit sometimes I will have a bite or two of my boyfriend’s non-vegan desserts (I’m only human), but all in all I just try to do the best I can everyday to not support animal suffering. I guess that is all anyone can really do.
Mandi, that is a really interesting distinction you make in your second paragraph. I honestly haven’t thought of it that way before. I admit that I’ve been mulling over this off and on today. On one hand I agree with you, but I do call myself a “vegan” even though not all aspects of my lifestyle of explicitly vegan (i.e. make up, shampoo, cleaning supplies, etc.). I am going to have to think about this some more, so thank you for the food for thought. :)
As I say explicitly on my blog, I’m a vegan for health reasons – period. I always say for people to just do what works for them and not to judge others. We should all get along :)
I am also vegan for health reasons, but there is a big part of me that really hates how the food industry exploits animals. Would I stay vegan if I didn’t have the health issues? I honestly don’t know, but I am really glad that I have found ways to enjoy my diet health issues aside. I don’t feel that I am “missing” anything by excluding dairy and eggs.
Clearly the priority is on your self. You honestly don’t know if you’d be vegan if a health issue forced you to be?
Why do you think you are a vegan, because you eat the same diet as us while you consume animals in non-food forms?
Sorry, my mistake. You eat honey so you do not even qualify for the dietary component.
I actually no longer consume honey. I now use agave nectar. :)
If you are a vegan for health reasons you are not a vegan.
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